I tried to watch this when linked on another site (further proof that Florrie and I cruise the same news sites) but even though I would probably agree, I was unable to watch past a few of the (totally unneccesary) bits of foul-mouthedness.
To be sure, Corolla is offering a caricature of the situation - but the appeal of good caricature is its fidelity to the underlying reality, not where it deviates or exaggerates. And the underlying reality is most definitely one in which a ridiculous sense of entitlement plays a substantial part.
The foul language is a business decision. It's based on the desire to reach a certain audience.
And note, the lack of profanity on the part of more conventional media is mostly the same - a business decision - and not the result of any essential propriety or civility.
florrie, Adam Corolla and "Doctor Drew" ran a talk show about sex which was aimed at teenagers. It ran in the '90s - back when you were a teenager, which is why you kinda remember... ;)
The foul language is a business decision. It's based on the desire to reach a certain audience.
Yep. Count me as part of that audience. I talk like that, and when I don't it is a conscious decision to moderate for a given audience. Now ask me about Obama and Congress, in a wholly casual setting, and my vernacular would make Adam Corolla blush, trust me.
I'm a potty-mouth as well. It's a release valve for me, I can control it (and I do in church), but we all have to have a way of dealing with stress. Mine is the f word. Although I actually use other words more often than the f word.
And I agree with Carolla. Not everyone can win, and we shouldn't piss on people who don't. But if you don't win, you don't get a trophy. Or, at least, you don't get the good trophy. Maybe you get the tiny little "Thank You For Playing!" trophy. Or the multicolored, "I participated!" ribbon. Whatever.
All it does is create a bunch of whiny brats who think that the world owes them.
I agree with Carolla. Not everyone can win, and we shouldn't piss on people who don't. But if you don't win, you don't get a trophy. Or, at least, you don't get the good trophy. Maybe you get the tiny little "Thank You For Playing!" trophy. Or the multicolored, "I participated!" ribbon.
I'm older than dirt, I admit ... but back in my "day", you got no "trophy" for participation. Period. What you got, if it was sports and you made it to the varsity team, was a "school letter" to wear on a jacket, if you chose to do so. A lot of guys gave their "letters" and jackets to girlfriends, in fact. You had to actually "win" an event, like first place, to get a trophy or any kind.
Some events awarded ribbons for "placing" first, second, third, etc. ... like in equine competitions, but unless it was an equitation event, the ribbon was for the horse, not you. Hah!
Now if you were in the math club or the science club, you got a "mention" in the annual school yearbook at most (I won letters and also was in those geeky clubs, but I never won a championship, in math or sports) ... your reward was having fun. Best times of my life were spent either on a fine horse going over fences or hurling one self down an Alpine downhill course at 60+ mph (slow by today's standards, I know I know)... the "reward", eh? G-i-r-l-s If you know either of those sports, you know they are full of pretty girls!! And you "traveled" together in the olden days. :D
How we got to this everybody gets a trophy crap today is beyond my comprehension. Makes the whole thing meaningless. The fun and actualization is in the trying.
I can't help but think that kids who play soccer (or whatever) in leagues where no one wins and no one loses really have no memory of having played -- the experience never really means anything to them. They made no investment into the time. But if they busted their butts, even if they came in last, then they have the effort to look back upon, even if they did not get a ribbon for "participation."
Now I do think that there are times when a game can be payed just for the sake of playing a game and having fun with other people, but I do not think that is the point of organized sports. The point of organized sports is to learn to do your best.
I do, however, think that with the Special Olympics a ribbon for participating is appropriate, because the lesson of the Special Olympics is that the participants can do things -- and, in that case, participating and following through is, indeed, a win. But that is a very special case.
Ari - Maybe it's because my kids all do sports that require intensive training that I think their drive should be recognized, even if they don't win. It's not the equivalent of winning, but an 11 year old who is in the gym 6 days a week for two or more hours of hard work (sparring is rough!), has a lot invested. The slightest tweak to your system before a tournament, and you can lose even if you are the better athlete and boxer - and it's completely beyond your control.
While nothing should be on the same level as winning, people do need the encouragement to keep on giving the level of dedication needed for a high level of performance when they *don't* win. And that's why I think a small token that can be pointed to is an important , "Hey! I participated in this event to keep them going. Didn't win, but not everyone can rank high enough to get there, and next time I *WILL* win"
My 13 year old swimmer is a bit of a different issue. In swimming, you're competing against yourself as much as anyone else. If you can shave even the smallest bit off a time, you know you're improving and working hard.* But not every sport has a built-in intrinsic motivation. And for the kids who come up against that, it's important to keep them motivated for the kind of training they need to keep up.
*disclaimer: The 13 y/o just dq'd in 200 back at a meet today and is LIVID. Apparently, the stroke judge counted her as using 4 flutter kicks after a turn. My daughter (and her actual coach) dispute this, but it doesn't matter - no appeals. So, while time is a good motivator, good stroke judges help, as well. Nothing can be as demoralizing as an unfair DQ.
I promise my second paragraph wasn't as garbled when I looked at it last... :)
Also - before anyone accuses me of being one of *those* moms... Evil Blond Child LOVES what she does. After her last opponent pulled out of the match, she took 2 weeks off. Her first day back she smiled the entire time she was sparring. And she asked me if she could incorporate triathlon training into her boxing training - she's driven.
What drives me nuts are the people who ask me if I'm pushing EBC too hard, but don't think twice about the 13 y/o being in the pool two hours a day, six days a week, plus dry-land work and running.
I can only assume it is because swimming is more of an "accepted" sport for girls than boxing. Also, because my 13 y/o looks 20.
If you do not learn how to lose then you do cannot learn anything at all.
Learning how to lose is actually foundational. It is the sin qua non - that without which there is nothing.
It's worse than just dealing with the emotional aspect of things... without losing you actually have no data about how the world works. (In algorithmic terms, your training set has no labeled outputs).
It's come up a couple times with our little investment group - we'll look at a real early startup company which has known nothing but success so far. It makes us very nervous, especially when the founders are themselves young.
I have no problem with kids losing. People should be participating on their merits, not with some Harrison Bergeron style competition. And some kids, no matter how much they want to be Olympic Swimmers, never will be. Even if they train harder than everyone else.
On the parent side of intensive training, though, I see too many people telling kids who are genuinely heartbroken over a loss when they gave it their all and worked harder than many adults watching EVER worked, get told to suck it up.
Yes, they need to learn to suck it up. But they also need to be told what they are doing RIGHT, and their hard work needs to be recognized. A steady diet of losing and the nastiness of hyper-competitive parent-audiences can kill a kid's spirit.
Which is why I see no problem with a separate "I Showed Up" ribbon. My husband got one for finishing Basic Training. Finishing Basic is an accomplishment, but so is the training required to be nationally competitive at a sport. These kids work HARD and have a discipline that a lot of adults don't have. It is something that should be rewarded, even if that reward is just, "Hey, we see how hard you are working. Keep it up!"
Everyone knows an "I Showed Up" ribbon is not an award. And it most certainly is NOT anywhere near the level of the winning trophy.
You husband did not show up, he COMPLETED basic training.
I do understand your point -- a certificate to acknowledge participation. However, that has morphed into giving the kid who showed up the same recognition as those who bust their, er, you know whats to be the best on the field.
When my son was in Cub Scouts, his den would play something of a baseball game, but with a soccer ball. One of the scouts, who worked hard in Little League, would smash the ball almost every time. Another scout, who did not even play Little League, would complain about how the other kid always hit the ball and hit it far -- "It's not fair!" I finally asked the kid -- "What's not fair about it? He works hard to be a good hitter -- and he is. You don't work at it. You're not a good hitter. What do you expect?"As Aridog said, high school players would get school letters (although I do not think that my son did -- he did not play enough, even though he was at all the practices and all of the games). As long as the kids who get that know that it is NOT the first place trophy and that the award is NOT saying they are as good at it as everyone else is, than a certificate of participation is fine.
Some of professional sports' best coaches were people who were not very good at playing -- Tommy Lasorda in baseball, Don Cherry in hockey, for example. But since they weren't that good at playing, they had to work hard. They understood the game and the mechanics of how it should be played. They weren't good players but they made fantastic coaches. By contrast, some people who were tops as players make terrible coaches -- because they do not know how to work with other to whom the sport does not come naturally.
Or to put it another way, I was in the middle of my high school graduating class. I have a diploma, but no one told me I was just as good as the valedictorian.
I think we're on the same page, Matt. I think that I see the "I Showed Up" ribbons as the letters high school varsity athletes were given. Again, the kids I see every day are the ones training with mine and spending 2 hours 5 or 6 days a week (pre-high school) in their sports year round. It's a different proposition than a couple of months of three times a week intro-to-whatever-sport practice.
The only reason it's a sore point with me is because the hyper-competitiveness of some parents (and observers) is ridiculous. I feel for those kids. No 12 year old should be getting booed at a sports event just because the other competitor had more friends and family show up. People have no manners sometimes. And it really does hurt those kids; their performance and their spirits. The organizations work hard to tamp that down, but people are assholes.
You're right, AFG (them Army Guy) finished Basic (barely!). But he calls it is "I Showed Up" ribbon. It's what I'm used to hearing.
Anyway - I'm absolutely NOT arguing against kids' sports having winners and losers. And kids need to face hard realities about winning and losing. The drive to win and the ability to keep going when you don't are tremendously important. I just don't like the way it I've seen that morph into, "So and so won, and eff ALL the rest of ya'll" with kids. There will always be people who act that way, but even just one person who takes the time to tell a kid who just saw their dream smashed what they did well can make a big difference.
Anyway, I think that I do see the participation ribbons as the equivalent of high school letters. It's a good comparison.
The only reason it's a sore point with me is because the hyper-competitiveness of some parents (and observers) is ridiculous. I feel for those kids. No 12 year old should be getting booed at a sports event just because the other competitor had more friends and family show up. People have no manners sometimes. And it really does hurt those kids; their performance and their spirits. The organizations work hard to tamp that down, but people are assholes.
I am in full agreement with you on that score, AFW. I think a child's endeavours should be encouraged, but not unrealistically hyped up. Anyone who has watched the audition on American Idol knows that each year people come in who can't carry a tune in a bucket, but they say that their family tells them they are the greatest singer that ever lived. Being acknowledged for participating is one thing, Being told they are great when they are not is something else.
The only kids who should be booed are the ones who are spoiled brats who do not exhibit sportsmanship on the field. And they are probably the first ones who would go home crying.
As Lewy said, losing is part of life, and kids need to learn about it.
That reminds me of another thing that bothers me: any time something happens, counsellors are brought in to help kids. At age 15, I was a pall bearer at the funeral of a kid who was two months younger than I was who died of a brain hemorrhage. I didn't have a counsellor to help me. People die. Get a grip. Now if something happened and someone saw it happened, then give that person help. But a fellow student was killed somehow, so the entire school needs counsellors? How are kids supposed to learn to cope with life?
If basic training had devolved from an "I completed it!" achievement to an "I showed up!" achievement in the same way that university degrees have so devolved, we'd be all be speaking {Russian, Chinese, Arabic - take your pick} by now.
Lewy, you speak the truth. Most university degrees aren't worth the paper they're printed on. I've had classes with teaching majors who cannot do simple math or write a coherent paragraph. But hey, you only need to maintain a 2.0 GPA (in Lassie classes like sociology and psychology) to get a teaching degree these days. It's frightening.
Matt, I'm sorry for your loss at such a young age. When I was 15, a classmate committed suicide over a biology grade. Back in those days, suicide wasn't something that was discussed. We didn't even have our parents to talk to. Us kids got through it together, and we did a lot of growing up that year.
Having a counselor would not have helped one iota, IMO.
I was doing research for something or another awhile ago, and saw an interesting scientific fact (although I never did go back later and confirm it): the brains of first world teenagers and third world teenagers are vastly different.
Not merely due to differences in diet, and the effect of being lower on Maslow's hierarchy - but because the brain responds to situations as it ages. Certain triggers that move someone from childhood to adulthood are environmental.
It certainly explains why we have a generation of people who are in their late twenties and still acting like middle schoolers. It also explains why, as little as two generations ago, people were able to marry as mid-teenagers and have successful lives.
This would certainly be related to the "everyone wins" discussion, I think. And would explain quite a lot. The road to hell is paved with good intentions, after all.
I don't know Adam Corolla (the name sounds familiar though) but I think his explanation is right on the money.
ReplyDeleteThe one percent who pays for 50 per cent. Ain't that the truth.
ReplyDeleteI tried to watch this when linked on another site (further proof that Florrie and I cruise the same news sites) but even though I would probably agree, I was unable to watch past a few of the (totally unneccesary) bits of foul-mouthedness.
ReplyDeleteGuess I really AM an old fuddy-duddy.
To be sure, Corolla is offering a caricature of the situation - but the appeal of good caricature is its fidelity to the underlying reality, not where it deviates or exaggerates. And the underlying reality is most definitely one in which a ridiculous sense of entitlement plays a substantial part.
ReplyDeleteThe foul language is a business decision. It's based on the desire to reach a certain audience.
And note, the lack of profanity on the part of more conventional media is mostly the same - a business decision - and not the result of any essential propriety or civility.
florrie, Adam Corolla and "Doctor Drew" ran a talk show about sex which was aimed at teenagers. It ran in the '90s - back when you were a teenager, which is why you kinda remember... ;)
ReplyDeleteOf course Florrie was a teenager in the '90s, but I hit my 40s in the '90s.
ReplyDeleteDo you know how sobering it is to have hit my 40s the decade before last?
Do you know how sobering it is to have hit my 40s the decade before last?
ReplyDeleteAsk me in about 8 years... :|
Thanks, lewy and Matt :-D
ReplyDeleteDo you know how sobering it is to have hit my 40s the decade before last?
ReplyDeleteI don't want to talk about it.
Oh wait, I'm only 29! I keep forgetting. They say memory is the second thing to go... ;))
Florrie, Carolla also did "The Man Show". That's where I know him from. :)
ReplyDeleteThat's it, lady red! I knew I heard of him from somewhere and, although I am familiar with Dr. Drew, I didn't know of their show.
ReplyDeleteOf course, like the boys said, I was only 12 back then.
img:"http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y117/floranista/dancingpurplebanana.gif"
The foul language is a business decision. It's based on the desire to reach a certain audience.
ReplyDeleteYep. Count me as part of that audience. I talk like that, and when I don't it is a conscious decision to moderate for a given audience. Now ask me about Obama and Congress, in a wholly casual setting, and my vernacular would make Adam Corolla blush, trust me.
I'm a potty-mouth as well. It's a release valve for me, I can control it (and I do in church), but we all have to have a way of dealing with stress. Mine is the f word. Although I actually use other words more often than the f word.
ReplyDeleteAnd I agree with Carolla. Not everyone can win, and we shouldn't piss on people who don't. But if you don't win, you don't get a trophy. Or, at least, you don't get the good trophy. Maybe you get the tiny little "Thank You For Playing!" trophy. Or the multicolored, "I participated!" ribbon. Whatever.
All it does is create a bunch of whiny brats who think that the world owes them.
AFW said ...
ReplyDeleteI agree with Carolla. Not everyone can win, and we shouldn't piss on people who don't. But if you don't win, you don't get a trophy. Or, at least, you don't get the good trophy. Maybe you get the tiny little "Thank You For Playing!" trophy. Or the multicolored, "I participated!" ribbon.
I'm older than dirt, I admit ... but back in my "day", you got no "trophy" for participation. Period. What you got, if it was sports and you made it to the varsity team, was a "school letter" to wear on a jacket, if you chose to do so. A lot of guys gave their "letters" and jackets to girlfriends, in fact. You had to actually "win" an event, like first place, to get a trophy or any kind.
Some events awarded ribbons for "placing" first, second, third, etc. ... like in equine competitions, but unless it was an equitation event, the ribbon was for the horse, not you. Hah!
Now if you were in the math club or the science club, you got a "mention" in the annual school yearbook at most (I won letters and also was in those geeky clubs, but I never won a championship, in math or sports) ... your reward was having fun. Best times of my life were spent either on a fine horse going over fences or hurling one self down an Alpine downhill course at 60+ mph (slow by today's standards, I know I know)... the "reward", eh? G-i-r-l-s If you know either of those sports, you know they are full of pretty girls!! And you "traveled" together in the olden days. :D
How we got to this everybody gets a trophy crap today is beyond my comprehension. Makes the whole thing meaningless. The fun and actualization is in the trying.
I can't help but think that kids who play soccer (or whatever) in leagues where no one wins and no one loses really have no memory of having played -- the experience never really means anything to them. They made no investment into the time. But if they busted their butts, even if they came in last, then they have the effort to look back upon, even if they did not get a ribbon for "participation."
ReplyDeleteNow I do think that there are times when a game can be payed just for the sake of playing a game and having fun with other people, but I do not think that is the point of organized sports. The point of organized sports is to learn to do your best.
I do, however, think that with the Special Olympics a ribbon for participating is appropriate, because the lesson of the Special Olympics is that the participants can do things -- and, in that case, participating and following through is, indeed, a win. But that is a very special case.
Special Olympics are the exception that proves the rule.
ReplyDeleteOr what used to be the rule.
I agree with you about the Special Olympics, Matt.
ReplyDeleteI'm thankful to have grown up in a non-PC era. Very thankful.
Of course, I had to walk 2 miles to school...uphill...in snow...barefoot...both ways...
Gawd, I can't believe I'm so old I'm repeating THAT one :-D
Must be time to post this.
Ari - Maybe it's because my kids all do sports that require intensive training that I think their drive should be recognized, even if they don't win. It's not the equivalent of winning, but an 11 year old who is in the gym 6 days a week for two or more hours of hard work (sparring is rough!), has a lot invested. The slightest tweak to your system before a tournament, and you can lose even if you are the better athlete and boxer - and it's completely beyond your control.
ReplyDeleteWhile nothing should be on the same level as winning, people do need the encouragement to keep on giving the level of dedication needed for a high level of performance when they *don't* win. And that's why I think a small token that can be pointed to is an important , "Hey! I participated in this event to keep them going. Didn't win, but not everyone can rank high enough to get there, and next time I *WILL* win"
My 13 year old swimmer is a bit of a different issue. In swimming, you're competing against yourself as much as anyone else. If you can shave even the smallest bit off a time, you know you're improving and working hard.* But not every sport has a built-in intrinsic motivation. And for the kids who come up against that, it's important to keep them motivated for the kind of training they need to keep up.
*disclaimer: The 13 y/o just dq'd in 200 back at a meet today and is LIVID. Apparently, the stroke judge counted her as using 4 flutter kicks after a turn. My daughter (and her actual coach) dispute this, but it doesn't matter - no appeals. So, while time is a good motivator, good stroke judges help, as well. Nothing can be as demoralizing as an unfair DQ.
I promise my second paragraph wasn't as garbled when I looked at it last... :)
ReplyDeleteAlso - before anyone accuses me of being one of *those* moms... Evil Blond Child LOVES what she does. After her last opponent pulled out of the match, she took 2 weeks off. Her first day back she smiled the entire time she was sparring. And she asked me if she could incorporate triathlon training into her boxing training - she's driven.
What drives me nuts are the people who ask me if I'm pushing EBC too hard, but don't think twice about the 13 y/o being in the pool two hours a day, six days a week, plus dry-land work and running.
I can only assume it is because swimming is more of an "accepted" sport for girls than boxing. Also, because my 13 y/o looks 20.
If you do not learn how to lose then you do cannot learn anything at all.
ReplyDeleteLearning how to lose is actually foundational. It is the sin qua non - that without which there is nothing.
It's worse than just dealing with the emotional aspect of things... without losing you actually have no data about how the world works. (In algorithmic terms, your training set has no labeled outputs).
It's come up a couple times with our little investment group - we'll look at a real early startup company which has known nothing but success so far. It makes us very nervous, especially when the founders are themselves young.
I have no problem with kids losing. People should be participating on their merits, not with some Harrison Bergeron style competition. And some kids, no matter how much they want to be Olympic Swimmers, never will be. Even if they train harder than everyone else.
ReplyDeleteOn the parent side of intensive training, though, I see too many people telling kids who are genuinely heartbroken over a loss when they gave it their all and worked harder than many adults watching EVER worked, get told to suck it up.
Yes, they need to learn to suck it up. But they also need to be told what they are doing RIGHT, and their hard work needs to be recognized. A steady diet of losing and the nastiness of hyper-competitive parent-audiences can kill a kid's spirit.
Which is why I see no problem with a separate "I Showed Up" ribbon. My husband got one for finishing Basic Training. Finishing Basic is an accomplishment, but so is the training required to be nationally competitive at a sport. These kids work HARD and have a discipline that a lot of adults don't have. It is something that should be rewarded, even if that reward is just, "Hey, we see how hard you are working. Keep it up!"
Everyone knows an "I Showed Up" ribbon is not an award. And it most certainly is NOT anywhere near the level of the winning trophy.
You husband did not show up, he COMPLETED basic training.
ReplyDeleteI do understand your point -- a certificate to acknowledge participation. However, that has morphed into giving the kid who showed up the same recognition as those who bust their, er, you know whats to be the best on the field.
When my son was in Cub Scouts, his den would play something of a baseball game, but with a soccer ball. One of the scouts, who worked hard in Little League, would smash the ball almost every time. Another scout, who did not even play Little League, would complain about how the other kid always hit the ball and hit it far -- "It's not fair!" I finally asked the kid -- "What's not fair about it? He works hard to be a good hitter -- and he is. You don't work at it. You're not a good hitter. What do you expect?"As Aridog said, high school players would get school letters (although I do not think that my son did -- he did not play enough, even though he was at all the practices and all of the games). As long as the kids who get that know that it is NOT the first place trophy and that the award is NOT saying they are as good at it as everyone else is, than a certificate of participation is fine.
Some of professional sports' best coaches were people who were not very good at playing -- Tommy Lasorda in baseball, Don Cherry in hockey, for example. But since they weren't that good at playing, they had to work hard. They understood the game and the mechanics of how it should be played. They weren't good players but they made fantastic coaches. By contrast, some people who were tops as players make terrible coaches -- because they do not know how to work with other to whom the sport does not come naturally.
Or to put it another way, I was in the middle of my high school graduating class. I have a diploma, but no one told me I was just as good as the valedictorian.
ReplyDeleteI think we're on the same page, Matt. I think that I see the "I Showed Up" ribbons as the letters high school varsity athletes were given. Again, the kids I see every day are the ones training with mine and spending 2 hours 5 or 6 days a week (pre-high school) in their sports year round. It's a different proposition than a couple of months of three times a week intro-to-whatever-sport practice.
ReplyDeleteThe only reason it's a sore point with me is because the hyper-competitiveness of some parents (and observers) is ridiculous. I feel for those kids. No 12 year old should be getting booed at a sports event just because the other competitor had more friends and family show up. People have no manners sometimes. And it really does hurt those kids; their performance and their spirits. The organizations work hard to tamp that down, but people are assholes.
You're right, AFG (them Army Guy) finished Basic (barely!). But he calls it is "I Showed Up" ribbon. It's what I'm used to hearing.
Anyway - I'm absolutely NOT arguing against kids' sports having winners and losers. And kids need to face hard realities about winning and losing. The drive to win and the ability to keep going when you don't are tremendously important. I just don't like the way it I've seen that morph into, "So and so won, and eff ALL the rest of ya'll" with kids. There will always be people who act that way, but even just one person who takes the time to tell a kid who just saw their dream smashed what they did well can make a big difference.
Anyway, I think that I do see the participation ribbons as the equivalent of high school letters. It's a good comparison.
Matt @23 - I think that's another excellent comparison/way to explain.
ReplyDeleteI didn't do a very good job explaining what I was trying to say, myself.
The only reason it's a sore point with me is because the hyper-competitiveness of some parents (and observers) is ridiculous. I feel for those kids. No 12 year old should be getting booed at a sports event just because the other competitor had more friends and family show up. People have no manners sometimes. And it really does hurt those kids; their performance and their spirits. The organizations work hard to tamp that down, but people are assholes.
ReplyDeleteI am in full agreement with you on that score, AFW. I think a child's endeavours should be encouraged, but not unrealistically hyped up. Anyone who has watched the audition on American Idol knows that each year people come in who can't carry a tune in a bucket, but they say that their family tells them they are the greatest singer that ever lived. Being acknowledged for participating is one thing, Being told they are great when they are not is something else.
The only kids who should be booed are the ones who are spoiled brats who do not exhibit sportsmanship on the field. And they are probably the first ones who would go home crying.
As Lewy said, losing is part of life, and kids need to learn about it.
That reminds me of another thing that bothers me: any time something happens, counsellors are brought in to help kids. At age 15, I was a pall bearer at the funeral of a kid who was two months younger than I was who died of a brain hemorrhage. I didn't have a counsellor to help me. People die. Get a grip. Now if something happened and someone saw it happened, then give that person help. But a fellow student was killed somehow, so the entire school needs counsellors? How are kids supposed to learn to cope with life?
If basic training had devolved from an "I completed it!" achievement to an "I showed up!" achievement in the same way that university degrees have so devolved, we'd be all be speaking {Russian, Chinese, Arabic - take your pick} by now.
ReplyDeleteLewy, you speak the truth. Most university degrees aren't worth the paper they're printed on. I've had classes with teaching majors who cannot do simple math or write a coherent paragraph. But hey, you only need to maintain a 2.0 GPA (in Lassie classes like sociology and psychology) to get a teaching degree these days. It's frightening.
ReplyDeleteMatt, I'm sorry for your loss at such a young age. When I was 15, a classmate committed suicide over a biology grade. Back in those days, suicide wasn't something that was discussed. We didn't even have our parents to talk to. Us kids got through it together, and we did a lot of growing up that year.
ReplyDeleteHaving a counselor would not have helped one iota, IMO.
I think we're on the same page, Matt. I think that I see the "I Showed Up" ribbons as the letters high school varsity athletes were given.
ReplyDeleteThat's a very good point AFW.
I was doing research for something or another awhile ago, and saw an interesting scientific fact (although I never did go back later and confirm it): the brains of first world teenagers and third world teenagers are vastly different.
ReplyDeleteNot merely due to differences in diet, and the effect of being lower on Maslow's hierarchy - but because the brain responds to situations as it ages. Certain triggers that move someone from childhood to adulthood are environmental.
It certainly explains why we have a generation of people who are in their late twenties and still acting like middle schoolers. It also explains why, as little as two generations ago, people were able to marry as mid-teenagers and have successful lives.
This would certainly be related to the "everyone wins" discussion, I think. And would explain quite a lot. The road to hell is paved with good intentions, after all.
I'll bet the brains between the "spoiled rotten" cohort and the "school of hard knocks" cohort are vastly different regardless of country or age.
ReplyDeleteI'm thinking of the dichotomy between the OWSers and the Tea Partiers.